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Cristopher55
Nightwish is a staple gothic metal band cuz they were at the Wave Gotik Treffen in 2000 i dont make the rules...
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unnamedfile
How to make a goth metal band... Step 1 make a band that play heavy metal or nonmetal or alternative metal or nu metal, because the music doesn't matter anyway step 2 put a piano in the background if you're really into it step 3 get 5 losers dressed like clown drag queens and there you have it.
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ole-the-first
Step 1 take the legacy of Tiamat, My Dying Bride, Anathema, Katatonia, Paradise Lost, Cradle of Filth, Lacrimosa, Tristania and Green Carnation and try to fetch one nu metal riff out of them step 2 shut your face you disgraced poser schlimazel
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L57NT
I'm note sure about this yet, but it seems to me that gothic metal has two major camps: 1) gothic-doom, which is soft melodramatic death-doom, sometimes devoid of gothic rock influences as such, at least apparently they are not necessary; and 2) gothic metal, which actually gravitates more or less towards something like gothic rock with metallic riffs or something like that, and not necessary containing any elements of doom metal in its turn. Seems sometimes like different genres altogether if not for the fact that there are no clear boundaries between them, and some bands played both (such as ToT or Lacrimas Profundere). And there are also secondary symphonic varieties, poppier varieties of gothic metal, that makes things even more confusing... what a mish mash of a genre
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Adalgoth
There is also a black metal-based branch of gothic metal, which combines black metal riffs with gothic rock elements: early Katatonia ('92 - '95), Moonspell and Tristania. It's also interesting that the first mentioned variety was born in Rogaland; the whole '90's extreme metal scene of this Norwegian county was characterized by its obsession with aesthetics of gothic romanticism, which was probably not only an influence of British doom death scene, but also early Carpathian Forest and their '93 demo in particular (some ex-members of that band formed The Sins of thy Beloved, by the way). There were also some Southern European bands, notable for mixing the key ideas of "Into the Pandemonium" with Christian Death and Mediterranean music influences (Sadness (SWI), Monumentum) and Carpathian Full Moon, self-described as "gothic metal", but I personally prefer to classify them as "hellenic black metal from the North", they're pretty much in one league with bands like Algaion.
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bonjovyborges
hurts my soul, why people insist in saying Nightwish, Epica or even Evanescence is gothic meta;?
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Erlequin
It's tough to make a list like this, as many of my top "gothic metal" albums come from artists I wouldn't put under this tag as a whole... like Cemetary's wonderful "Godless Beauty" and "Black Vanity" are surely near the top, while their later works (which I do love) are more rock/pop. Or Lake of Tears (from whose page I came, and am still confused about) made the exquisite "Greater Art" but pretty much all their other music instead dialed up the 1970s-influenced aspects (though then again even Type O Negative had a strong soft-rock current running through their work...). Groups like Moonspell with an extensive discography where I love every album *and* would also put under "gothic metal" seem rare to me!
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TheUnhinged
WT haven't been gothic for 20 years now, Lacuna Coil for 15 years now. Nightwish were always symphonic/power metal, there has never been anything goth about them. Bands like Tristania, Paradise Lost, Type O Negative, Theatre of Tragedy, Tiamat, combined GOTHIC ROCK with Metal, which is what made them GOTHIC METAL.
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Umbrylical
Gothic Metal is very underwhelming. It's really frustrating how a genre defined by an aesthetic so broad, and ripe to be approached in so many instrumental and compositional approaches, inspires so many bands to become pigeonholed to WAY too many cliches, specially of the cheesy and melodramatic kind. Also, it's very disappointing to see so many Gothic bands softening up and becoming bland rip offs of Sisters of Mercy and the like, to the point that's a cliche on its own; even good seminal artists from this style of music lose their edge by conforming to this boring trope (*ahem* Paradise Lost and Tiamat *ahem*). Plus the EXTREME corniness of some artists is an immense turn off. Like yuck. Lastly, and tied to the last two points, the commercial success of the genre clearly made a lot of people eager to jump in and get their share with bland, overtly simplistic and streamlined pop metal. It wouldn't be so terrible if there weren't so many of those. Frustrating indeed.
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Umbrylical
Also, what's up with gothic and absolutely dreadful album covers. Even more yuck.
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Silanis
Well, gothic metal seems to be more of an umbrella term for dark and egdy metal bands that may or may not draw some tiny inspo from gothic rock bands like the Nephilim or the Sisters of Mercy. But as this shoutbox proves, with its endless discussions about it is or isn't, it's all in all a very loosely connected "genre". One that, thanks to having been hyped in the 90s when nobody had a fucking clue what goth and darkwave music really was and lumped it in with metal, became filled with mediocre shit. The only listenable bands are imo Type O negative who also have some sort of post-punk influence. Paradise Lost honestly never saw themselves as that and they always did their own thing, so I don't agree with you here (their last albums are def more doom than "gothic"). Tiamat is ok… and that's it. Most other stuff is just symphonic metal with some bland opera singer.
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Ms_Antrophia
So according to nDroae, any band that's dark is gothic: Where are Mayhem then? They surely fit the 'gothic' tag because you know... they're gloomy. Where the fuck is Soilwork? They have melodic tones, they surely are gothic.
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nDroae
Regarding the differentiation of symphonic metal from gothic metal, here's a memory that's almost as amusing as it is frustrating. One of the first true gothic metal bands, from the city of Stavanger which seems to be iconic in the genre, was Theatre of Tragedy. Their female vocalist Liv Kristine later started the symphonic metal band Leaves' Eyes. That band put out a DVD documentary in 2009, including an interview with a respected veteran from the metal community. (I could pop the DVD in now and check who, but I don't think it matters much.) In his interview, he expressed disapproval that bands like Leaves' Eyes were recently being referred to as "female fronted metal," and said people ought to go back to calling them what they really are - "gothic metal." No mention of "symphonic metal" at all! As a fan of symphonic metal, I wish the term were better-known. Thankfully, record labels have been using it on CD stickers lately.
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nDroae
In the end, the best comparison I can think of is the term "classical music." Wikipedia: "The dates of the Classical period in Western music are generally accepted as being between about the year 1730 and the year 1820. However, the term classical music is often used in a colloquial sense as a synonym for Western art music which describes a variety of Western musical styles from the Middle Ages to the present, and especially from the seventeenth century to the nineteenth." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_period_(music) There it is: "often used in a colloquial sense." Nightwish is not gothic metal, but "in a colloquial sense," it kind of is. Last.fm tags are a systematized representation of colloquial speech about music.
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nDroae
There actually was, at one point, a user who ran a bot account that watched this Gothic Metal tag. The bot had been programmed with a blacklist of bands that are not gothic metal. When any user tagged one of those bands as gothic metal, the bot automatically left a shout in their shoutbox informing them of their mistake, with a link to a page containing a definition of true gothic metal and examples of true gothic metal bands. ALL FOR NAUGHT. Here we stand on a mountain of the corpses of arguments, and Within Temptation and Nightwish are still the top "gothic metal" bands. My suggestion: instead of coming to this page to correct people, come here with suggestions of good, less well known, legit gothic metal bands. I found Beloved Enemy that way.
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bluegrassishhh
v How is "goth metal" different from gothIC metal? It's not exactly a well-kept secret that the bands you (and seemingly everyone else in this shoutbox) are referring to are all here almost exclusively because of their imagery and their lyrics and not due to any actual connecting to gothic metal - so we can probably stop complaining about it. It's clearly not making a difference.
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LeavesEyesfan
This genre has to be one of the more controversial genres in metal. Trying to separate the true gothic metal bands from the goth metal bands ( if goth metal is an actual genre). i started to notice most of the bands like Nightwish, Lacuna Coil, Within Temptation, Evanescence, Epica and HIM are considered by many to be apart of the gothic metal genre even though most say their music is either rock or some other metal yet none have been more vocal about this than the bands I have mentioned. Yet since they wear black clothing, have somewhat dark atmosphere and dark lyrics they apparently fall into this genre.
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OverMadness
Lacuna Coil is a Gothic metal band. After Comalies Lacuna Coil made an incursion into alternative metal, but always keeping a gothic feeling. Nightwish is certainly a Symphonic metal band, not gothic. Within Temptation with just one album in the genre (Enter) should not appear in the list. Where is Tristania or even The Gathering (Mandylion is a Masterpiece)?
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